Can some please pay my fuel bill :(

£12,879 :( no wound i never have any money lol

If that is the fuel bill then you should have invoiced out at least double.

Look on the brightside, £10, 000 of that will of gone to the Goverment tax and vat.

Williams Transport said:

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If that is the fuel bill then you should have invoiced out at least double.

Double :( more like x 3.5 ;)

How about if I send you £12,879 in Monopoly money. Would that help?

Thompson Direct said:

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Williams Transport said:

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If that is the fuel bill then you should have invoiced out at least double.

Double :( more like x 3.5 ;)

I agree but was trying to be diplomatic in case the OP is running a 44 tonne artic.

Sniff sniff.

12879 not a new start up then. :-)

Mason Group said:

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Sniff sniff.

you want me to scan it again les like the £10 Courier Exchange one lol

Lewis Haulage said:

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12879 not a new start up then. :-)

Still going strong even after people/person lose me good money

Hill Group said:

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How about if I send you £12,879 in Monopoly money. Would that help?

Please i might just beat my kids at it then lol

Williams Transport said:

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Thompson Direct said:

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Williams Transport said:

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If that is the fuel bill then you should have invoiced out at least double.

Double :( more like x 3.5 ;)

I agree but was trying to be diplomatic in case the OP is running a 44 tonne artic.

Only have one of them at the minute, i would like an 18t and 1 more artic in the new year

Thompson Direct said:

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Mason Group said:

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Sniff sniff.

you want me to scan it again Tracey like the £10 Courier Exchange one lol

If you want, I'm not doubting the fuel bill its the £46,076.50 invoiced work I wouldn't mind seeing. :-)

Mason Group said:

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Thompson Direct said:

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Mason Group said:

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Sniff sniff.

you want me to scan it again les like the £10 Courier Exchange one lol

If you want, I'm not doubting the fuel bill its the £46,076.50 invoiced work I wouldn't mind seeing. :-)

last month is the best month we have had since trading, last week wasnt good 8.8k, doesnt seem to bad until i look at sage and see how much we are owed :( then i get a little twitchy

At least ive got a good set of customers know, unlike the 1's that stab you in the back after 2 years and never missing a run with 7 vans (at least that 2 years paid for the house lol)

Mason Group said:

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Thompson Direct said:

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Mason Group said:

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Sniff sniff.

you want me to scan it again les like the £10 Courier Exchange one lol

If you want, I'm not doubting the fuel bill its the £46,076.50 invoiced work I wouldn't mind seeing. :-)

If you are that concerned you can pay my tax bill if you like :)

The other thing you have to think about les im doing alot of bigger work aberdeen £1250 every friday evening, reading 5 days per week with 2 returns thats nearly 3k , thats 18k on its own thats just 2 jobs pen to paper for the next 2 yrs 50 weeks per year, the vans did about 22k, and my subby bill for the trucks was about 9k, then ive got about 1k in subby vans

• the trucks have an 7% fuel surcharge as well ;)

Thompson Direct said:

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The other thing you have to think about Tracey im doing alot of bigger work aberdeen £1250 every friday evening, reading 5 days per week with 2 returns thats nearly 3k , thats 18k on its own thats just 2 jobs pen to paper for the next 2 yrs 50 weeks per year, the vans did about 22k, and my subby bill for the trucks was about 9k, then ive got about 1k in subby vans

• the trucks have an 7% fuel surcharge as well ;)

Well done its nice to see you doing so well and long may it ontinue.

I would love to have your fuel bill to add to mine.

You are obviously running a worthwhile business and maybe need some assistance with the realities of cashflow when expanding - do not be afraid to look at invoice factoring, that is why it exists.

You are not running a cash based market stall.

Williams Transport said:

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I would love to have your fuel bill to add to mine.

You are obviously running a worthwhile business and maybe need some assistance with the realities of cashflow when expanding - do not be afraid to look at invoice factoring, that is why it exists.

You are not running a cash based market stall.

Factoring? I would imagine Simon has more sense than to get into that racket! Once in hard or impossible to get out, plus the charges are horrendous!
I know through companies stuck in it, that alot of customers do not like the hassle they get from the factoring companies constantly hassling them checking invoices etc! Many large companies are put off doing business with any that factor!

Taylor Logistics said:

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Williams Transport said:

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I would love to have your fuel bill to add to mine.

You are obviously running a worthwhile business and maybe need some assistance with the realities of cashflow when expanding - do not be afraid to look at invoice factoring, that is why it exists.

You are not running a cash based market stall.

Factoring? I would imagine Simon has more sense than to get into that racket! Once in hard or impossible to get out, plus the charges are horrendous!
I know through companies stuck in it, that alot of customers do not like the hassle they get from the factoring companies constantly hassling them checking invoices etc! Many large companies are put off doing business with any that factor!

Popular Myth.

Williams Transport said:

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Taylor Logistics said:

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>Many large companies are put off doing business with any that factor!

Popular Myth.

The garment company I used to work for (it feels like another life it was so long ago) was owned by House of Fraser, I was told to stop using a particular supplier as they had began factoring invoices

[business] said:

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Williams Transport said:

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Taylor Logistics said:

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Many large companies are put off doing business with any that factor!

Popular Myth.

The garment company I used to work for (it feels like another life it was so long ago) was owned by House of Fraser, I was told to stop using a particular supplier as they had began factoring invoices

And that's no myth ;)

Williams Transport said:

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I would love to have your fuel bill to add to mine.

You are obviously running a worthwhile business and maybe need some assistance with the realities of cashflow when expanding - do not be afraid to look at invoice factoring, that is why it exists.

You are not running a cash based market stall.

Knowing Simon there is no way on this earth he would use factoring, why anyone would pay someone up to 20% of their turnover todo so is beyond me.

Mason Group said:

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Williams Transport said:

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I would love to have your fuel bill to add to mine.

You are obviously running a worthwhile business and maybe need some assistance with the realities of cashflow when expanding - do not be afraid to look at invoice factoring, that is why it exists.

You are not running a cash based market stall.

Knowing Simon there is no way on this earth he would use factoring, why anyone would pay someone up to 20% of their turnover todo so is beyond me.

Exactly!

1.4% would be nearer the mark unless you have small turnover and are subject to minimum turnover charges.

The 20% figure is what is held back until your customer pays up when the balance is passed forward to you.

Williams Transport said:

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1.4% would be nearer the mark unless you have small turnover and are subject to minimum turnover charges.

The 20% figure is what is held back until your customer pays up when the balance is passed forward to you.

Plus [I understand] a monthly charge for the privilege!

Main thing if you don't mind losing a percentage of your Invoice, one may well lose some customers too, as I know they constantly harass those invoiced to check on fraud etc.

Better off with an overdraft surely?

Williams Transport said:

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1.4% would be nearer the mark unless you have small turnover and are subject to minimum turnover charges.

The 20% figure is what is held back until your customer pays up when the balance is passed forward to you.

Not when, I think you mean if!

Mason Group said:

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Williams Transport said:

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1.4% would be nearer the mark unless you have small turnover and are subject to minimum turnover charges.

The 20% figure is what is held back until your customer pays up when the balance is passed forward to you.

Not when, I think you mean if!

In that situation it would make no difference whether the invoice was factored or not - it would go to court with an excellent paper trail.

Factoring and invoice discounting are two products to help cash flow. Used properly the can build your business. If you have large enough turnover go for confidential invoice discounting, that way you run credit control and your customer is not aware. I have been involved with factoring companies for many years. Somegood some poor, no matter which keep credit control inhouse. Ask yourself why some customers dont like factors, slow payers perhaps.

Turner Logistics said:

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Ask yourself why some customers dont like factors, slow payers perhaps.

+1

Williams Transport said:

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I would love to have your fuel bill to add to mine.

You are obviously running a worthwhile business and maybe need some assistance with the realities of cashflow when expanding - do not be afraid to look at invoice factoring, that is why it exists.

You are not running a cash based market stall.

Factoring il will never touch it ;)

Williams Transport said:

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Turner Logistics said:

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Ask yourself why some customers dont like factors, slow payers perhaps.

+1

Rubbish if I deal with some one Its because I want to work with them, not some factoring company in my opinion its the worse form of finance just above loan sharks

No longer deal with many companies / drivers because THEY factor. Nothing to do with wanting extended credit terms etc as it doesnt really apply - as invoices are cleared within 7-10 days of it landing with us. Majority of the time sooner.

Few of those now invoice us direct and we refuse to deal with their factoring company.

Knight & Sons said:

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No longer deal with many companies / drivers because THEY factor. Nothing to do with wanting extended credit terms etc as it doesnt really apply - as invoices are cleared within 7-10 days of it landing with us. Majority of the time sooner.

Few of those now invoice us direct and we refuse to deal with their factoring company.

As do most companies, who get cheesed off with constant calls checking invoice amounts etc, it is understandable as without those checks, the person factoring could have a field day, never the less, it is annoying for those having to deal with factoring companies / Sales finance banks!

I had a chap phone me a few months back from Courier Exchange saying if i factored my money with bibby? I could have free membership. Didnt interest me but i wonder how many they recruited?

Turner Logistics said:

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Factoring and invoice discounting are two products to help cash flow. Used properly the can build your business. If you have large enough turnover go for confidential invoice discounting, that way you run credit control and your customer is not aware. I have been involved with factoring companies for many years. Somegood some poor, no matter which keep credit control inhouse. Ask yourself why some customers dont like factors, slow payers perhaps.

Imho factoring means DONT HAVE POT TO PISS IN

Thompson Direct said:

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Turner Logistics said:

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Factoring and invoice discounting are two products to help cash flow. Used properly the can build your business. If you have large enough turnover go for confidential invoice discounting, that way you run credit control and your customer is not aware. I have been involved with factoring companies for many years. Somegood some poor, no matter which keep credit control inhouse. Ask yourself why some customers dont like factors, slow payers perhaps.

Imho factoring means DONT HAVE POT TO PISS IN

Ha ha about right Si :)

Thompson Direct said:

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Turner Logistics said:

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Factoring and invoice discounting are two products to help cash flow. Used properly the can build your business. If you have large enough turnover go for confidential invoice discounting, that way you run credit control and your customer is not aware. I have been involved with factoring companies for many years. Somegood some poor, no matter which keep credit control inhouse. Ask yourself why some customers dont like factors, slow payers perhaps.

Imho factoring means DONT HAVE POT TO PISS IN

Simon is 99% right as I know a couple of fairly big hitters who use it successfully but the majority of one man bands that use it as a last resort, also agree with H as the constant badgering by these companies really pisses me off.

i will not work for anyone that factors and i will not have anyone work for me

"Imho factoring means DONT HAVE POT TO PISS IN "

I beg to differ.

Question!

A company offers you a lucrative contract, It is worth say £25,000 a week and will increase as it progresses.

It's a Huge Global company that you know is in excellent health.

Downside is that payment is 90 - 120 days

You have a good bank balance but this contract will drain it rapidly with driver costs and current commitments.

Do you

A Have a large expensive overdraft

B use factoring and work the cost into your pricing

C Turn down the contract or split it with another company

Just some thoughts chaps

To answer the above,

Overdraft is the best solution after talking with Bank manager.

Once in to Factoring, it is almost impossible to get out!

As discussed, MOST 'Huge Global Companies' do not like working with those who factor!

As above, take paper work signed letters and everything you have re the work and go to the bank ask for overdraft

A Have a large expensive overdraft, its cheaper than factoring

Banks have a habit of lending money and withdrawing it on a change of policy. Latest scandal on loan rate agreements capped fine but dont go down with low interest rates. Banks dont trust them.

We have been looking at different options and we have been offered a 30 day rolling agreement, no leaving penalty and 3% with no disbursments or other hidden charges.

Oh and we would look after our own credit control and do the late payer chasing.

So... They are charging 3% on 30 day invoices , 36% per annum? Even on 60 day invoices its 18% per annum with none of the chasing?

Thompson Direct said:

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i will not work for anyone that factors and i will not have anyone work for me

How do you know if who your working for factors? Or do you ask them?

I am undecided with factoring. I look at it as You are not borrowing so you cannot get into debt. You are simply paying for the access to your own earned money a little sooner. I don't think this is a bad thing, we pay a few courier companies through a factoring company and it makes no difference whatsoever. We owe that amount so we pay it. I had 1 call from Bibby to verify a company is due payment from us and that was that. I have never had a factoring company call me with demands of payment. This is because we pay on time, It's simple really.

Anderson Services said:

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Thompson Direct said:

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i will not work for anyone that factors and i will not have anyone work for me

How do you know if who your working for factors? Or do you ask them?

Because the Factoring co. Contact all customers that the company factoring raise invoices to!

Hewitt Logistics said:

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I am undecided with factoring. I look at it as You are not borrowing so you cannot get into debt. You are simply paying for the access to your own earned money a little sooner. I don't think this is a bad thing, we pay a few courier companies through a factoring company and it makes no difference whatsoever. We owe that amount so we pay it. I had 1 call from Bibby to verify a company is due payment from us and that was that. I have never had a factoring company call me with demands of payment. This is because we pay on time, It's simple really.

IF your customer doesn't pay the Invoice, the Bank [or factoring company] will recourse what is owed and withhold monies until they are paid. So you can very quickly get in to debt as using a factoring facility in no way guarantees any invoice will be paid.
Quite likely however that a company will stop doing business with you once they discover Invoices are factored.

I know a few who have been well & truly screwed up once sucked into it.

From my research the ones that get suckered are the ones that are tied into 12 and 24 month agreements.

Taylor Logistics said:

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Anderson Services said:

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Thompson Direct said:

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i will not work for anyone that factors and i will not have anyone work for me

How do you know if who your working for factors? Or do you ask them?

Because the Factoring co. Contact all customers that the company factoring raise invoices to!

99% of my work is for a printers (owned by my other halfs parents) i know they factor there invoices but i only know because of the family connection, i email them my invoice 2 weeks later they email me a remittance slip & the money is in my account, ive never received anything from there factoring company.

Thompson Direct said:

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As above, take paper work signed letters and everything you have re the work and go to the bank ask for overdraft

Just had a quick look at overdraft rates, Average 5.5%

Speak to your bank you will get a fix rate also lower than that as well

Peoples opinions on factoring will always be good or really bad. Firstly there are some myths out there about how much it costs with some people saying they take large percentages of your income. On average a factor company will charge around £4.00 for every £100 you invoice. You will get up to 90% of the invoice within a couple of days from doing the job straight into your bank. There is no monthly charge, just the percentage that you have agreed with them. This percentage charge could be lower depending on your income. They dont have to verify all invoices just some of them and they will send a statement to your customer as well as there being a notice of who to pay on your invoice. Instead of paying the subbie into his bank or a cheque you pay the factor company. However i do understand why some companies do not like dealing with them,and the answer to this is simple,if a customer does not want to deal with a factor company the person who is invoicing simply tells their factors this and the company just pays the subbie direct and the subbie sends the payment to the factor company.This way no one is upset. As for comments like anyone who uses factoring hasnt a pot to piss in is complete rubbish. If i for instance invoice in a week £1000.00 i will get £860 of that within 2 days,thats 90% minus the fee,i will then get the other £100 when the customer pays. If someone doesnt pay by 90 days they will draw back that invoice amount until they pay, if you factor or not that customer still wont have paid. Ive had only 2 late payments in 5 months. So if i invoice £60,000 in a year it will cost me £2400 for getting 90% of my money within days of invoicing. I have many more larger things to pay than that. Also every ones situation is different,for me personally i spent many years working myself to near death with my own artic and after losing that along with a very serious personal situation the only way i could start courier work again was to factor my invoices at the start. I am doing well through hard work and making great contacts and in 6 months i wont need to factor. Sorry its such a long post but think a bit before people judge some ones business.

ESI, Whoever you factor with seems alot cheaper than others I know about!
Most also have a very expensive monthly charge for administration. I still think it a dangerous thing to get into, I was strongly advised by my accountant to avoid at all costs, as it is especially difficult to quit once started.

To me its a no brainer, if you need to 'borrow' an overdraft is by far the best and cheapest solution.

As I said, I know for a fact that many very large organisations are strongly against doing business with companies that use factoring.

Taylor Logistics said:

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ESI, Whoever you factor with seems alot cheaper than others I know about!
Most also have a very expensive monthly charge for administration. I still think it a dangerous thing to get into, I was strongly advised by my accountant to avoid at all costs, as it is especially difficult to quit once started.

To me its a no brainer, if you need to 'borrow' an overdraft is by far the best and cheapest solution.

As I said, I know for a fact that many very large organisations are strongly against doing business with companies that use factoring.

Hi Rapid, I do understand where you are coming from. Obviously i would rather not have to factor invoices but the position i was in, it has been a great help to get me started again. If i could have got an overdraft i would but my bank are not that helpful to new business start ups. For what it costs me and what im earning it works for me. I just wanted to point out that some people (not you)are quick to slate it and condemn everyone who does it as skint and desperate without knowing the true figures or circumstances of the people doing it.

Factoring charges are between. 75 and 4% the higher the turnover the less you should pay. For which you recieve between 75 and 90% of your invoices by return. Most factor deal with credit control not brilliantly, but most of us are slow asking for payment.

Yes 3% is what we have been quoted with no monthly fees whatsoever and no disbursments. We have a very large scale project coming up and do not want to borrow at all, We have no debts or vehicles on finance or lease and we would like to keep it that way. In our favour we have over 60k in unpaid invoices so we are looking at realising some of this cash, All our drivers are up to date so whay not.

Hewitt Logistics said:

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Yes 3% is what we have been quoted with no monthly fees whatsoever and no disbursments. We have a very large scale project coming up and do not want to borrow at all, We have no debts or vehicles on finance or lease and we would like to keep it that way. In our favour we have over 60k in unpaid invoices so we are looking at realising some of this cash, All our drivers are up to date so whay not.

3% is a decent rate, and as i mentioned in my earlier post it can be very helpful.You can use it as a good tool if done properly. It always amazes me how some people will absolutely slate something without knowing the real facts. Yes we all have opinions and thats fine but to judge people who factor as skint is so stupid and ignorant. Good luck with whatever path you decide to go down.